View source for File talk:Spr 4p 407 m.png

Explain something to me: why is this not the same sprite as [[:File:407.png|this]]? If there is no reason, then I will have to conclude that Spr 4h 407 m.png is different from Spr 4p 407 m.png. [[User:Ht14|<span style="color:#E1E1E1"><sup>'''''ht'''''</sup></span>]][[User talk:Ht14|<span style="color:#B69E00"><small>''14''</small></span>]] 22:07, 28 December 2009 (UTC)

:Not all uploads of a sprite come from the same source, you know.  Sprite rippers don't all use the exact same methods.  The same sprite placed at the "Spr 4? ###.png" (we'll call this slot A) position by unnamed ripper A and a sprite placed at the "###.png" (we'll call this slot B) by unnamed ripper B wouldn't be seen by the system as the exact same file due to minimal differences in how the sprite rippers rip the sprites.  Such differences between slot A and slot B are especially apparent in those with current game sprites of Generation III or Generation IV Pokémon that may have had uploads to slot A and slot B at different times.  They're more common with the normal coloration, and from there with the male gender differences, primarily because some people give preferential treatment to normal-color male sprites and neglect the rest.  Trust me, there were points during the Platinum update (back when we didn't have the alternate-coloration current game sprites, and the current game sprites fro the female gender differences wound up neglected for quite a time), where the only spritework for a Pokémon that got updated was the slot B sprite, without any upload to slot A at all; such treatment may have been prone to a "ripper A, slot A"/"ripper B, slot B" scenario.

:In this instance, we have a "ripper A, slot A"/"ripper B, slot B" scenario on our hands.  Slot B was initially Platinum-updated to the female gender difference instead of the male; however, the correct slot B for a female gender difference in this case was [[:File:407 f.png|407 f.png]].  When {{u|Kenji-girl}} rectified this mishap, the gender difference correction was done with a sprite from a different source rather than a simple reupload of the slot A sprite.  That's the reason slot A and slot B in this case are not showing up as duplicates of one another; they came from different rippers.

:The fact that this scenario is still lingering right now is the fact that Roserade is a Generation IV Pokémon.  The first two generations, as well as a select few others who had slight coloration differences, were able to undergo a HeartGold/SoulSilver update to their slot B sprites (this time including all alternate colorations and gender differences included), and these usually followed on the heels of a slot A upload based on the same ripper (there were primarily two sources used whose full names I dare not utter lest I get in trouble with the Bulbapedia editor-in-chief; one starts with an S, the other with a V).  Since Roserade didn't have any sprite alterations in HeartGold/SoulSilver, the ripper difference scenario is still in place because there wasn't new spritework to update the slot B sprite with.  --[[User:Shiningpikablu252|Shiningpikablu252]] 00:49, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

::Thank you for clearing that up for me. I needed to know the reason behind this. However, I did realize that while uploading duplicates, there is a notification that cautions me whether or not I'd still like to upload that file. For that, I don't think the reasoning behind the "ripper A, slot A is different from ripper B, slot B" idea is accurate. There are different uploaders for [[:File:003 f.png|this]] and [[:File:Spr 4h 003 f.png|this]] for instance, but they are registered as identical.

::I'd like to also point out that this may be the reason behind different sprites for normal-colored Pokémon, but the same for shiny-colored ones. One instance is with Mareep. The normal sprites for it are different (compare [[:File:Spr 4d 179.png|this]] and [[:File:Spr 4p 179.png|this]]), however, the shiny sprites are the same. Might this be a result of what you're saying then? [[User:Ht14|<span style="color:#E1E1E1"><sup>'''''ht'''''</sup></span>]][[User talk:Ht14|<span style="color:#B69E00"><small>''14''</small></span>]] 01:39, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

:::On your first paragraph, they're registered as identical for one of two reasons.  Either both uploaders grabbed the sprite directly from the same ripper, or the updater of the slot B sprite simply reuploaded the HG/SS slot A sprite onto the slot B position.  This is actually how most of the alternate-coloration current game sprites came into being, with a great deal of them subsequently updated for later spritework in much of the same fashion; in these cases, the case of different uploaders is primarily because the slot A uploader didn't even know there was a slot B for the alternate coloration (the alternate coloration current game sprites didn't come into being until after the mass Platinum updates; however, several sprites continued to use a Diamond/Pearl representation for quite awhile, in a few cases even up to the HeartGold/SoulSilver update, despite updated Platinum spritework due to said updated spritework not having been uploaded to the slot A, hence no way to update the slot B without directly going to the S ripper or the V ripper, a practice that was not done in mass until the HeartGold/SoulSilver update).

:::As for the second paragraph, those discrepancies are currently due to the 4p slot A positions having been redirected to the 4d slot A positions before any color difference was brought up.  Anyone who brought up such color differences brought them up only for the normal coloration, and as such only the normal coloration had their redirects erased and replaced with the color adjustments.  However, if there's slight color differences for the normal coloration, then odds are the same is true for the alternate coloration; this was not overlooked when handling the HeartGold/SoulSilver cases.  In all actuality, the only case where there should be redirects in some slots but not in others is that of Milotic; the 4h positions should redirect to the 4p positions in all cases except alternate-coloration female due to a sprite error on the alternate-coloration female in Platinum having been fixed for HeartGold/SoulSilver and no spritework differences otherwise.  --[[User:Shiningpikablu252|Shiningpikablu252]] 02:35, 29 December 2009 (UTC)